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  1. #61
    not really All-Star ih8music's Avatar
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    McQueary put on administrative leave now, and apparently in protective custody after multiple death threats. Pretty sad.

    Recently came across this - this by no means excuses McQueary's actions (rather, inaction), but it's an interesting perspective into how iconic and universally loved Jerry Sandusky was by his players and people who knew him.

    http://espn.go.com/v...id=espn:7219531

    Watching that, I've gotta say that if I saw someone who I considered to be almost Mother Theresa-like doing something as horrific as raping a child, I can't honestly say that I wouldn't also freak out and run. That's just gotta be mind-blowing and shocking to a level hard to comprehend.

    But then, once the initial shock wore off, I hope to God that I would have called police - that aspect of his actions is still just unbelievable and indefensible.

  2. #62
    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    McQueary played High School football.

    Who did he play High School football with?

    Jon Sandusky. Jerry's son. Just saying.



  3. #63
    Senior Member Hall of Famer phaneuf6's Avatar
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    I tend to side with ih8 here. While I am by no means condoning what happened here, I don't know how I would react to seeing that or what I would do in that situation, so I find it really hard to point fingers and criticize him. I HOPE that I would approach the police but I don't know that.

  4. #64
    2010 Dead Pool Champion All-Star Hockeyis#1's Avatar
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    Imagine if you didn't see it, and were hearing the information 2nd hand, 3rd hand, etc.


  5. #65
    Senior Member Hall of Famer two24four's Avatar
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    What does everyone think of them playing the game tomorrow? they where talking about this on radio today, one of them said he thinks they should play, but he thinks they should not let anyone into watch, as well as not showing it on TV.

  6. #66
    Senior Member All-Star snoopzen's Avatar
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    Bottom line - Reporting child abuse to the authorities should not be a judgment call. No matter who the perpetrator is.

    I know that as a teacher, if I hear any kind of allegations of child abuse, I don't go with the information to the principal and ask for his/her advice. I'm legally bound to report the incident directly to Children's Aid and let their investigators investigate.

    Maybe the allegations will prove to be unfounded. Maybe not. But it's not up to me to decide. The welfare of the child takes precedence over any other concerns, and since inaction could lead to further abuse, it has to go to the next level.

  7. #67
    2010 Dead Pool Champion All-Star Hockeyis#1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by two24four View Post
    one of them said he thinks they should play, but he thinks they should not let anyone into watch, as well as not showing it on TV.
    Why? That really makes no sense.


  8. #68
    Season Ticket Holder Hall of Famer Dubz's Avatar
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    I think its funny how you guys are making this shitout to be one "isolated" incident. From what ive heard theres alot more than one child involved. Its sickening that any one of you would pull out the mastercard and charge this garbage up. This aint Mike Vick sayin " I didnt fight dogs" Motherfuckers!!!

    ANyways im happy to be less on the know....enjoy the rest of the show.
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  9. #69
    Season Ticket Holder Hall of Famer Dubz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hockeyis#1 View Post
    Imagine if you didn't see it, and were hearing the information 2nd hand, 3rd hand, etc.
    I couldnt imagine that
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  10. #70
    King Nitbag Hall of Famer Doctego's Avatar
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    Not that I want to do Sandusky any favors but I would like to recommend that, when Costas or anyone else calls Sandusky for an interview, his attorney tells him to respond with no comment. That Costas interview was a tough listen.


  11. #71
    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Not even going to bother to comment much more on this, especially after tonights interview.

    Sandusky is the biggest piece of shit on earth.



  12. #72
    not really All-Star ih8music's Avatar
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    Meanwhile, in the you-couldn't-make-this-shit-up-if-you-tried dept:

    http://m.nypost.com/p/news/national/...=SFnewyorkpost

  13. #73
    King Nitbag Hall of Famer Doctego's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ih8music View Post
    Meanwhile, in the you-couldn't-make-this-shit-up-if-you-tried dept:

    http://m.nypost.com/p/news/national/...=SFnewyorkpost
    Damn.


  14. #74
    * * * * * * Hall of Famer b_illin's Avatar
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    Separately, the Big Ten has decided to take Paterno’s name off its championship trophy. League commissioner Jim Delany said that it is “inappropriate” to keep Paterno’s name on the trophy that will be awarded Dec. 3 to the winner of the conference’s first title game.
    The trophy had been named the Stagg-Paterno Championship Trophy. Paterno had more wins (409) than any major college coach while football pioneer Amos Alonzo Stagg won 319 games in 57 years at the University of Chicago.
    The trophy will now be called the Stagg Championship Trophy.
    Frankly, I think it's inappropriate to take his name off the trophy.

  15. #75
    Season Ticket Holder Hall of Famer Dubz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b_illin View Post
    Frankly, I think it's inappropriate to take his name off the trophy.
    You'd feel differently if it was one of your kids B_illin. Just sayin. Frankly, i dont give a rats ass
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  16. #76
    * * * * * * Hall of Famer b_illin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dubz View Post
    You'd feel differently if it was one of your kids B_illin. Just sayin. Frankly, i dont give a rats ass
    Maybe, and I definitely think a lot of the comments in this thread are from parents and are as such a bit skewed to the one side.

    I don't see how any of this warrants having his name removed from the trophy...at least not while Paterno's role in all of this is still murky and unknown. It's super knee jerk and, while it may turn out that Joe should have said more or whatever, I still fail to see how any of this would alter what he accomplished as a coach which is why his name was on that trophy.

    Paterno was a large influence in making the Big Ten the powerhouse that it is today and it angers me that his legacy is being ruined by some kiddie diddler and the ensuing media circus that is forcing knee jerk reactions like this one. I don't know Paterno's actual involvement and neither do any of you. If it turns out he was really negligent, than ok, but this is just ridiculous.

  17. #77
    Washed Up All-Star Spartan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b_illin View Post

    Paterno was a large influence in making the Big Ten the powerhouse that it is today and it angers me that his legacy is being ruined by some kiddie diddler and the ensuing media circus that is forcing knee jerk reactions like this one. I don't know Paterno's actual involvement and neither do any of you. If it turns out he was really negligent, than ok, but this is just ridiculous.
    We read the Grand Jury report, we know how he was involved. So does Paterno, he said himself he should have done more.

    And no Paterno had nothing to do with the success of the Big Ten. His name should never have been on the trophy to begin with. Lloyd Carr and Jim Tressel have exponentially more accomplishments than Joe Paterno since PedoU joined the conference. By the time they joined, Joe was a figurehead that sat in the press box without a headset. He is no better than Barry Alvarez, Kirk Ferentz, John Cooper or Gary Barnett since joining the Big Ten. His name was on the trophy because of the whole Leaders/Legends marketing nightmare that Jim Delaney started last year. If you look back I complained about it then as well.




  18. #78
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    I'm not a parent, not interested in being one for at least 10 years. I still don't think Paterno has received his just dues for the damage he caused with his inaction, and I don't think firing him or removing his name from some trophy even begins to repay him fairly. He isn't solely or directly responsible for anything that happened, but in a case this severe and disgusting, partial responsibility is more than enough, and he certainly has his share of blame here.

  19. #79
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    Also, its amazing how often the legal system is misinterpreted for the sake of supporting your guy's points. Legally, we DO know Paterno's involvement here. I don't get this "innocent until proven guilty" bullshit getting thrown around. Theres an eye witness account in the grand jury report, Paterno's involvement is legally established. He would need to prove his NON-involvement at this point to sway anybody in the NCAA or otherwise.

    Now we fall down to the next cheap copout "We don't know HOW much he knew." Again, yes we do. Read the report. His negligence is well documented and established. The NCAA isn't just making snap decisions for the fun of it. Obviously his legacy meant as much to him as it did to all of you guys because he chose to protect it and his friend over reporting child rape.

  20. #80
    Senior Member Hall of Famer phaneuf6's Avatar
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    I tend to agree with Bill here.

  21. #81
    King Nitbag Hall of Famer Doctego's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle View Post
    Also, its amazing how often the legal system is misinterpreted for the sake of supporting your guy's points. Legally, we DO know Paterno's involvement here. I don't get this "innocent until proven guilty" bullshit getting thrown around. Theres an eye witness account in the grand jury report, Paterno's involvement is legally established. He would need to prove his NON-involvement at this point to sway anybody in the NCAA or otherwise.

    Now we fall down to the next cheap copout "We don't know HOW much he knew." Again, yes we do. Read the report. His negligence is well documented and established. The NCAA isn't just making snap decisions for the fun of it. Obviously his legacy meant as much to him as it did to all of you guys because he chose to protect it and his friend over reporting child rape.
    This is purely my opinion but I truly believe that we don't know what Paterno knew because, when it's all said and done, I have a feeling that there will be a tremendous cover up revealed.


  22. #82
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    Thats fair enough but I just don't understand why people are falling on "innocent until proven guilty" when the reality is he legally has been proven to have known about this as long as the eye witness account remains valid. Nothing has suggested it won't. I've obviously disagreed with a legal conclusion or two and I'll respect that some people might here (Though I think its outrageous but thats not worth arguing), but the fact is Penn State has to act based on the grand jury report. And the fact is comments like "If it turns out he was really negligent, than ok, but this is just ridiculous" by Bill are absurd. It has already turned out he was negligent. You can disagree and proceed from there, but its already been established legally.

  23. #83
    not really All-Star ih8music's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle View Post
    Thats fair enough but I just don't understand why people are falling on "innocent until proven guilty" when the reality is he legally has been proven to have known about this as long as the eye witness account remains valid. Nothing has suggested it won't. I've obviously disagreed with a legal conclusion or two and I'll respect that some people might here (Though I think its outrageous but thats not worth arguing), but the fact is Penn State has to act based on the grand jury report. And the fact is comments like "If it turns out he was really negligent, than ok, but this is just ridiculous" by Bill are absurd. It has already turned out he was negligent. You can disagree and proceed from there, but its already been established legally.
    Even if the McQueary's account turns out to be absolutely false (which I doubt), the allegation alone is enough. Paterno and his "superiors" were legally (& morally!) supposed to report it, but instead they chose to protect the program/university/their buddy over the child (who they never even attempted to identify and is still unknown).

    Their solution was to ask Sandusky to not bring any more kids into the showers -- essentially telling him "we don't care what you do on your own, just don't put us in this position again."

    Once all the dust settles, this will likely be one of the biggest scandals ever in higher education, not just college football.

  24. #84
    not really All-Star ih8music's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctego View Post
    Not that I want to do Sandusky any favors but I would like to recommend that, when Costas or anyone else calls Sandusky for an interview, his attorney tells him to respond with no comment. That Costas interview was a tough listen.
    Apparently, it was the lawyer's idea to get Sandusky on the phone with Costas! As if admitting to showering with boys and "only" horsing around with them while naked was going to somehow make people believe that you're not a pervert.

    The part when Costas asks him directly if he's sexually attracted to little boys and Sandusky fuddled around with his answer before eventually saying no was absolutely creepy.
    Last edited by ih8music; 11-15-2011 at 06:19 PM.

  25. #85
    Geek Extraordinaire Hall of Famer Hamsterkill's Avatar
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    Correct me if I'm wrong here, Kyle, but there was never a legal conclusion on Paterno. He's not even the subject of a criminal investigation. There are the testimonies in the grand jury report and that's it. I'm not a lawyer, but I don't think that constitutes any kind of legal conclusion. Even Sandusky is still walking free waiting for his legal conclusion.

    The only thing I question is how much of what Paterno was told did he actually believe at the time. I know if someone told me they saw one of my friends doing what Sandusky was doing, I'd have my doubts about their claim. Attempting to put myself in Paterno's shoes in this case, I might be able to understand his actions. I'm not saying what he did was right or that it's what I'd have done in his place -- just that it's understandable he didn't go directly to police and instead reported it to people he expected to look into the claim further and take proper action. Looking back, we all agree -- even Paterno -- that he should have done more. I just wonder how clear cut it was to him at the time.
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  26. #86
    not really All-Star ih8music's Avatar
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    Yeah, Paterno is safe from the law because he reported it up to his "superiors" Shultz and Curley -- the buck fell on them when they declined to contact child protective services. page 12 of the report spells it out.

    As for how much they believed it or not, that's why it's called mandatory reporting -- it's not for them to decide the merits of the accusation; the accusation alone requires it to be reported. Everyone I've ever known in education knows this and knows it well.
    Last edited by ih8music; 11-15-2011 at 07:08 PM.

  27. #87
    King Nitbag Hall of Famer Doctego's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle View Post
    Thats fair enough but I just don't understand why people are falling on "innocent until proven guilty" when the reality is he legally has been proven to have known about this as long as the eye witness account remains valid. Nothing has suggested it won't. I've obviously disagreed with a legal conclusion or two and I'll respect that some people might here (Though I think its outrageous but thats not worth arguing), but the fact is Penn State has to act based on the grand jury report. And the fact is comments like "If it turns out he was really negligent, than ok, but this is just ridiculous" by Bill are absurd. It has already turned out he was negligent. You can disagree and proceed from there, but its already been established legally.
    I think that I agree with you. Please let me know if I don't. Basically, I think that Penn State had no choice but to fire him. He can have his day in court regarding any criminal or civil charges but whatever happens in those proceedings has nothing to do with whether firing him was the right thing to do. 1 of the last statements by Paterno is probably going to cost him a shitload in civil court. I am referring to when he said that "I should have done more". That's when his lawyer told him to STFU.

    Quote Originally Posted by ih8music View Post
    Apparently, it was the lawyer's idea to get Sandusky on the phone with Costas! As if admitting to showering with boys and "only" horsing around with them while naked was going to somehow make people believe that you're not a pervert.

    The part when Costas asks him directly if he's sexually attracted to little boys and Sandusky fuddled around with his answer before eventually saying no was absolutely creepy.
    I missed this part of the interview but, apparently the lawyer was in studio with Costas and Sandusky was on the phone. At some point, Costas asked the lawyer if he would trust Sandusky around his kids and he said yes. While I understand that he has to protect his client, I wouldn't feel comfortable with my kids around him based solely on what he admitted to (showering with the kids, playing with them in the shower, touching their leg, etc.).

    For anyone interested, here is a link of Mike Francesa interviewing Matt Paknis today:

    http://newyork.cbslocal.com/?podcast...g=&dcid=CBS.NY
    Last edited by Doctego; 11-15-2011 at 06:53 PM.


  28. #88
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    We do agree, I was more disagreeing with Bill through you.

    Hamster, not so much as a legal conclusion as much as it has been legally accepted that Paterno knew a certain amount.

  29. #89
    Geek Extraordinaire Hall of Famer Hamsterkill's Avatar
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    More like "legally on record".
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  30. #90
    * * * * * * Hall of Famer b_illin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamsterkill View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong here, Kyle, but there was never a legal conclusion on Paterno. He's not even the subject of a criminal investigation. There are the testimonies in the grand jury report and that's it. I'm not a lawyer, but I don't think that constitutes any kind of legal conclusion. Even Sandusky is still walking free waiting for his legal conclusion.
    This is what I mean Kyle - the grand jury report is not conclusive. I am not trying to suggest that there is any funny business going on, but the settlement will be a lot bigger with Joe Paterno's name involved...and the lawyers know that. Again, I don't think this is the case, but this quick rush to judgement by everyone is too much for me...a modern day lynch mob. I think that is absurd.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamsterkill View Post
    More like "legally on record".
    Exactly.
    Last edited by b_illin; 11-15-2011 at 07:13 PM.

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