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Thread: Trade chat

  1. #1
    Senior Member Hall of Famer two24four's Avatar
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    Trade chat

    Thought with the deadline being this week I would start this thread.

    Looks like the LAD and CLE are talking about making a big move.

    http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9...dians'-Lee

    Wow Lee & also Martinez maybe heading to the Dodgers, that would be huge.

  2. #2
    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Hoping we do not do this move, I've been in contact since this morning when I first heard about this, and it seems to be getting serious and they are still in legit talks about Halladay.

    I rather stay put, but it'll be interesting I guess. I'll update what I can when I get it.



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    King Nitbag Hall of Famer Doctego's Avatar
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    Odd that the article doesn't mention Billingsley by name until the last sentence.


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    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctego View Post
    Odd that the article doesn't mention Billingsley by name until the last sentence.
    It was updated from earlier, the bottom of it is poorly written.



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    * * * * * * Hall of Famer b_illin's Avatar
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    If I were the LAD, I wouldn't do that deal. I think Bills is as good as Lee + he's just getting (edit) better and VMart is on the downside of his career.
    Last edited by b_illin; 07-26-2009 at 09:08 PM.

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    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b_illin View Post
    If I were the LAD, I wouldn't do that deal. I think Bills is as good as Lee + he's just getting and VMart is on the downside of his career.
    Bills isn't going, I can promise you that.



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    * * * * * * Hall of Famer b_illin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dawinna13 View Post
    Bills isn't going, I can promise you that.
    I figured as much...they'd be stupid to deal him at this point unless the return was THAT good for a WS run.

  8. #8
    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b_illin View Post
    i figured as much...they'd be stupid to deal him at this point unless the return was that good for a ws run.
    :d



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    * * * * * * Hall of Famer b_illin's Avatar
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    meant to say; i figured as much...they'd be stupid to deal him at this point unless the return was that good (for a serious ws run).

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    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b_illin View Post
    meant to say; i figured as much...they'd be stupid to deal him at this point unless the return was that good (for a serious ws run).
    I knew what you meant bud. I'm nervous about the trade deadline, don't want to see anyone go! Just some 'pen help!



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    Samurai Stickhandler All-Star toronto1979's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dawinna13 View Post
    Bills isn't going, I can promise you that.
    I'd also be very surprised if they traded Kershaw (even for Halladay).
    Kershaw has been equally as effective as Bills.

    Billingsley (25)
    3.72 ERA, 9.47 K/9, 1.29 WHIP

    Kershaw (21)
    2.96 ERA, 9.73 K/9, 1.26 WHIP

    Halladay (32)
    2.62 ERA, 8.72 K/9, 1.05 WHIP
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    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toronto1979 View Post
    I'd also be very surprised if they traded Kershaw (even for Halladay).
    Kershaw has been equally as effective as Bills.

    Billingsley (25)
    3.72 ERA, 9.47 K/9, 1.29 WHIP

    Kershaw (21)
    2.96 ERA, 9.73 K/9, 1.26 WHIP

    Halladay (32)
    2.62 ERA, 8.72 K/9, 1.05 WHIP
    We don't move either, (I hope) but there has been swirls about the Kershaw/Halladay deal.

    I just want Bullpen help and keep everything else in place.



  13. #13
    Senior Member All-Star CayugaPosse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b_illin View Post
    If I were the LAD, I wouldn't do that deal. I think Bills is as good as Lee + he's just getting (edit) better and VMart is on the downside of his career.
    How is V-Mart on the downside of his career? Granted he's 31, but he's experienced no dropoff outside of last year which was his injury plagued season.

    2007 he hit .303 with 25 HR and 114 RBI as a catcher.

    2009 he's on pace to hit .287 with 23 HR and 105 RBI as a catcher.

    Slip him over to first base and he's got a few years left in him. And he's a terrific hitter, a better hitter than either of James Loney or Russel Martin.

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    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CayugaPosse View Post
    How is V-Mart on the downside of his career? Granted he's 31, but he's experienced no dropoff outside of last year which was his injury plagued season.

    2007 he hit .303 with 25 HR and 114 RBI as a catcher.

    2009 he's on pace to hit .287 with 23 HR and 105 RBI as a catcher.

    Slip him over to first base and he's got a few years left in him. And he's a terrific hitter, a better hitter than either of James Loney or Russel Martin.
    I rather keep Loney, Josh Bell and Pedro Baez, then package some of them for Martinez. That's just me. I wouldn't complain but I like how we are right now.



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    Senior Member All-Star CayugaPosse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dawinna13 View Post
    I rather keep Loney, Josh Bell and Pedro Baez, then package some of them for Martinez. That's just me. I wouldn't complain but I like how we are right now.
    This kind of serves to put on notice a huge problem I have with the way general managers work in MLB, and same with prospects.

    Accomplished Major League superstars are better than prospects. The fact that the Phillies don't want to trade Drabek and Happ is SHOCKING to me for Roy Halladay. I wouldn't want that trade done from the JAYS point of view. You have 2 prospects, and there's no chance that either of those guys will ever be anything close to what you know for a fact Halladay is right now. It's asenine you wouldn't do that trade.

    Same thing here, granted you'd like to keep Loney, but Loney --> Martinez is a SIGNIFICANT upgrade, and well worth 2 prospects. Maybe you don't want to because of age...and that's acceptable, that's somehting I can understand(Loney young, Martinez slightly older).

    This season so far, has BAFFLED me that teams are so reluctant to trade prospects. Are they really that bad at their jobs suddenly? Prospects are just that, prospectively good players. If you can move a couple, and ensure you get one great player back...you ALWAYS do that trade.

  16. #16
    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CayugaPosse View Post
    This kind of serves to put on notice a huge problem I have with the way general managers work in MLB, and same with prospects.

    Accomplished Major League superstars are better than prospects. The fact that the Phillies don't want to trade Drabek and Happ is SHOCKING to me for Roy Halladay. I wouldn't want that trade done from the JAYS point of view. You have 2 prospects, and there's no chance that either of those guys will ever be anything close to what you know for a fact Halladay is right now. It's asenine you wouldn't do that trade.

    Same thing here, granted you'd like to keep Loney, but Loney --> Martinez is a SIGNIFICANT upgrade, and well worth 2 prospects. Maybe you don't want to because of age...and that's acceptable, that's somehting I can understand(Loney young, Martinez slightly older).

    This season so far, has BAFFLED me that teams are so reluctant to trade prospects. Are they really that bad at their jobs suddenly? Prospects are just that, prospectively good players. If you can move a couple, and ensure you get one great player back...you ALWAYS do that trade.
    You have a different view of prospects, that's fine. It isn't asenine, that I wouldn't do that trade.



  17. #17
    Senior Member All-Star CayugaPosse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dawinna13 View Post
    You have a different view of prospects, that's fine. It isn't asenine, that I wouldn't do that trade.
    Read my post again, I didn't say you were asenine for not doing that, I said the Phillies were asenine for not trading Happ/Drabek for Doc.

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    King Nitbag Hall of Famer Doctego's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CayugaPosse View Post
    This kind of serves to put on notice a huge problem I have with the way general managers work in MLB, and same with prospects.

    Accomplished Major League superstars are better than prospects. The fact that the Phillies don't want to trade Drabek and Happ is SHOCKING to me for Roy Halladay. I wouldn't want that trade done from the JAYS point of view. You have 2 prospects, and there's no chance that either of those guys will ever be anything close to what you know for a fact Halladay is right now. It's asenine you wouldn't do that trade.

    Same thing here, granted you'd like to keep Loney, but Loney --> Martinez is a SIGNIFICANT upgrade, and well worth 2 prospects. Maybe you don't want to because of age...and that's acceptable, that's somehting I can understand(Loney young, Martinez slightly older).

    This season so far, has BAFFLED me that teams are so reluctant to trade prospects. Are they really that bad at their jobs suddenly? Prospects are just that, prospectively good players. If you can move a couple, and ensure you get one great player back...you ALWAYS do that trade.
    I am with you on that but I think that I have some answers. Being a Yankee fan has allowed me to look at this topic a bit. You really need to look at the economy. In 1 way or another, it is hitting every team. Even the mighty Yankees with their unlimited resources. They can spend what they want but all of those empty seats in the lower level can't make them happy. The teams are feeling it. Take someone like Toronto. Their fast start notwithstanding, management obviously felt that they couldn't realistically compete for a playoff spot this season against the Sox, Yanks, and Rays. That's just in their own division. Halladay has 1 more year left on his deal so I'm sure that they looked at next season as well. They probably had a tug-of-war of sorts. Do they go balls out next season with Halladay or do they fasttrack a rebuild right now?? By doing this now, they will get a much better return than if they waited. The fact that they didn't think that they could sign Halladay to another deal just makes this more of a priority. I know that it sucks as a fan to see your team trade away better talent but they want to build something a little new. Something that they knew that Halladay wouldn't be a part of.


  19. #19
    Senior Member Hall of Famer two24four's Avatar
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    I agree that the Phillies are crazy for not doing the deal the Jays want, Happ, Drabek & Brown for Halladay, who is at least a top 3 SP in the game today (if not the best) who they would have for the rest of this season, this years playoffs, plus next year for sure as well, that also gives them a year & a half to try & re-sign him as well.

    Halladay would make the Phillies so much better, & odds on fav in the NL I would think.
    Last edited by two24four; 07-27-2009 at 04:55 PM.

  20. #20
    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    I agree to a point about the Drabek/Happ/Brown deal, but I'm not as high on Drabek and Happ as the Phillies are. But I completely understand why they wouldn't do it, its their top 3 prospects. Brown is going to be a very good outfielder in the future and they obviously really like Drabek/Happ.

    If it's me or you, we do the trade. But they see more of Happ and Drabek and rather keep blooming them and not pay the money for Halladay.

    I would do it, but they won't and I can see why.



  21. #21
    Senior Member Hall of Famer two24four's Avatar
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    Just read that the Jays are not backing down from there offer of Drabek/Happ/Brown for Halladay, so if Philly really wants Doc that's what it's going to take from the sounds of it.

    If a Halladay deal is to get done before Friday I would think it's comes before Halladay's next start, which is Wednesday in SEA, I doubt his "new" team would want him starting that game for the Jays.
    Last edited by two24four; 07-27-2009 at 05:15 PM.

  22. #22
    Senior Member First Liner Snipes16's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CayugaPosse View Post
    This kind of serves to put on notice a huge problem I have with the way general managers work in MLB, and same with prospects.

    Accomplished Major League superstars are better than prospects. The fact that the Phillies don't want to trade Drabek and Happ is SHOCKING to me for Roy Halladay. I wouldn't want that trade done from the JAYS point of view. You have 2 prospects, and there's no chance that either of those guys will ever be anything close to what you know for a fact Halladay is right now. It's asenine you wouldn't do that trade.

    Same thing here, granted you'd like to keep Loney, but Loney --> Martinez is a SIGNIFICANT upgrade, and well worth 2 prospects. Maybe you don't want to because of age...and that's acceptable, that's somehting I can understand(Loney young, Martinez slightly older).

    This season so far, has BAFFLED me that teams are so reluctant to trade prospects. Are they really that bad at their jobs suddenly? Prospects are just that, prospectively good players. If you can move a couple, and ensure you get one great player back...you ALWAYS do that trade.
    I think part of the problem in dealing for Halladay comes straight from him when he says he plans on testing the FA market at the end of 2010. Any team that trades for him most likely will have to part with 3 of their top prospects for what in reality is a rental player (albeit a very good one at that) for slightly over 1 years service because he probably isn't going to sign an extention if dealt and if he does he'll most likely be looking for Johan dollars...140+ million.

    While I agree with the theory of aquiring a great player to put you over the top, you dont always make the deal. Case in point was the deal Minnesota had on the table with Boston prior to Johan being traded to the Mets during the winter of 08. It was Santana for Lester and Ellsbury. How good did the Sox do in turning that down when looking back at it today? Instead of forking over 140+ million to Santana they extended Lester for 5 years at 30 million and will probably do the same with Ellsbury at close to what Lester got if they are smart. Thats 2 young prospects that pannned out for less than half of Santana's dough.

    Thats a huge key to winning longterm nowadays. Develop enough young pitching and resign them before they get too expensive ( free agency). Handing out 100 million dollar contracts to FA pitchers rarely turns out well and is very risky...Zito, J.Schmidt, Pedro with the Mets, BJ Ryan though it was only 47 million and even Santana hasn't lived up to what the Mets are currently paying him. And theres probably a good chance that the Yankees will get it stuck up their arse's with either Sabathia or Burnett flaming out somewhere along their contracts.


  23. #23
    Senior Member Hall of Famer two24four's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snipes16 View Post
    I think part of the problem in dealing for Halladay comes straight from him when he says he plans on testing the FA market at the end of 2010. Any team that trades for him most likely will have to part with 3 of their top prospects for what in reality is a rental player (albeit a very good one at that) for slightly over 1 years service because he probably isn't going to sign an extention if dealt and if he does he'll most likely be looking for Johan dollars...140+ million.
    I think what Halladay means is he's going to test FA if he's still a Jay when that times comes, I think if he's moved to a team like PHI, BOS, LAD, etc..... who will be good for a few years, then they will have a real good chance at re-signing him before he becomes a FA.

  24. #24
    * * * * * * Hall of Famer b_illin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toronto1979 View Post
    I'd also be very surprised if they traded Kershaw (even for Halladay).
    Kershaw has been equally as effective as Bills.

    Billingsley (25)
    3.72 ERA, 9.47 K/9, 1.29 WHIP

    Kershaw (21)
    2.96 ERA, 9.73 K/9, 1.26 WHIP

    Halladay (32)
    2.62 ERA, 8.72 K/9, 1.05 WHIP
    Game 7 of the World Series, you want Halladay.

    Quote Originally Posted by CayugaPosse View Post
    How is V-Mart on the downside of his career? Granted he's 31, but he's experienced no dropoff outside of last year which was his injury plagued season.

    2007 he hit .303 with 25 HR and 114 RBI as a catcher.

    2009 he's on pace to hit .287 with 23 HR and 105 RBI as a catcher.

    Slip him over to first base and he's got a few years left in him. And he's a terrific hitter, a better hitter than either of James Loney or Russel Martin.
    Well, do you see him getting better? If no, then he is on the downside of his career...as in at best you can expect current production.

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    * * * * * * Hall of Famer b_illin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CayugaPosse View Post
    This kind of serves to put on notice a huge problem I have with the way general managers work in MLB, and same with prospects.

    Accomplished Major League superstars are better than prospects. The fact that the Phillies don't want to trade Drabek and Happ is SHOCKING to me for Roy Halladay. I wouldn't want that trade done from the JAYS point of view. You have 2 prospects, and there's no chance that either of those guys will ever be anything close to what you know for a fact Halladay is right now. It's asenine you wouldn't do that trade.

    Same thing here, granted you'd like to keep Loney, but Loney --> Martinez is a SIGNIFICANT upgrade, and well worth 2 prospects. Maybe you don't want to because of age...and that's acceptable, that's somehting I can understand(Loney young, Martinez slightly older).

    This season so far, has BAFFLED me that teams are so reluctant to trade prospects. Are they really that bad at their jobs suddenly? Prospects are just that, prospectively good players. If you can move a couple, and ensure you get one great player back...you ALWAYS do that trade.
    Seriously. At best these guys might turn into a....Roy Halladay'esque player! Chances of that are slim...and you get Roy for two postseasons. I don't get it....the best pitcher in baseball or certainly a top 3 guy and teams are balking at the asking price. Get fucked if you don't want to pay what he's 'worth' (because chances are the team getting Roy gets the better end of the deal!)

  26. #26
    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b_illin View Post
    Seriously. At best these guys might turn into a....Roy Halladay'esque player! Chances of that are slim...and you get Roy for two postseasons. I don't get it....the best pitcher in baseball or certainly a top 3 guy and teams are balking at the asking price. Get fucked if you don't want to pay what he's 'worth' (because chances are the team getting Roy gets the better end of the deal!)
    I'm sure a Philly fan would say get lost they rather keep Happ, Drabek and Brown. You can't blame them.

    I'd tell the Jays to blow me if they wanted Kershaw, Gordon and Ethan Martin, to be honest..



  27. #27
    * * * * * * Hall of Famer b_illin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dawinna13 View Post
    I'm sure a Philly fan would say get lost they rather keep Happ, Drabek and Brown. You can't blame them.

    I'd tell the Jays to blow me if they wanted Kershaw, Gordon and Ethan Martin, to be honest..
    Well, we all know Philly fans are dumb fucks, so....

    (with the exception of Santana, none of the guys traded in recent years bring what Halladay does...oh, and he's under contract WAY below mkt value for another season and 2 postseasons. Philly fans can balk....and watch a team like the Dodgers get Roy & win the World Series!)

  28. #28
    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b_illin View Post
    Well, we all know Philly fans are dumb fucks, so....

    (with the exception of Santana, none of the guys traded in recent years bring what Halladay does...oh, and he's under contract WAY below mkt value for another season and 2 postseasons. Philly fans can balk....and watch a team like the Dodgers get Roy & win the World Series!)
    It's their top 3 prospects for a player that possibly they would lost in a year+. I can completely understand where they and YOU guys are coming from too.

    I would never bitch about getting a player of Roy's caliber but if we didn't, I'm fine with it. Starting pitching is a need for the Dodgers, as is bullpen help.

    It'll be interesting, but you guys calling out Philly like they. They don't want to gut their farm system, it's understandable.



  29. #29
    Samurai Stickhandler All-Star toronto1979's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dawinna13 View Post
    It's their top 3 prospects for a player that possibly they would lost in a year+.
    If Roy were to get traded to the Phillies or the Dodgers, I would almost guaruntee that he extends his contract with one of them.

    He's a loyal player and wants to play for a winner. LA and Philly are winners. Why would he test the FA market to take more money to go back to a team like the Jays?
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  30. #30
    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toronto1979 View Post
    If Roy were to get traded to the Phillies or the Dodgers, I would almost guaruntee that he extends his contract with one of them.

    He's a loyal player and wants to play for a winner. LA and Philly are winners. Why would he test the FA market to take more money to go back to a team like the Jays?
    He would go to a winner either way in the FA market, there is no bets he stays with the Dodgers.

    Either way, it'll be interesting.



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