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  1. #1
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    6th Year HI Baseball Keeper

    Hey guys,
    Time to take a roll call of the members returning. I hope we will only have to replace PhilaFury.

    1. Pockets - IN
    2. Diamond Dogs - IN
    3. Cooperstown Legends- IN
    4. Schomi Skydogs - IN
    5. PhilaFury (darwinna13) - IN
    6. Rico - IN
    7. Cashew Losers {CHAMPION} - IN
    8. Hiro Mets- IN
    9. Base Bandits - IN
    10. Hawkeyes - IN
    11. suckerpuncher - IN
    12. GreenMonster - IN

    Stealing from KK's league timing. I would like to have everyone's keepers in by Friday at Midnight. This way we can have the weekend to prepare and start the draft on the Yahoo Group page on Monday the 21st.
    Last edited by rico3994; 02-15-2012 at 09:20 PM.

  2. #2
    Senior Member All-Star
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    I'm back, of course.

    What were the keeper rules again? 6 + 2 I think but I'm not quite sure what the rookie limitation was.


    Any chance to push back the draft to mid-February? Normally I'm a fan of drafting early.
    But most teams haven't even completed trades and the MLB rosters aren't set. And since the draft should not take more than a month we'd still have enough time.

    But if anybody else is fine with January, 21st I'm cool with that too.


  3. #3
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    I would rather not push back the draft start time. With 28 positions on each team that means we have 240 spots to fill during the draft. Even with 2 months we may be cutting it close to the opener on the 25th of March.

    And yes, this is the last year of the 2 bonus keepers rule, for next years draft everyone just gets 8 keepers.

  4. #4
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    Alrright, then January, 21st it is.

    Did we sepcify a max. number of games or IP a "rookie" was not allowed to exceed more than 2x?


    And did we also agree on changing the draft order for the next year? Like the champ drafting last and the 6th ranked team after the plyoffs drafting 7th?
    If not I propose it right now.


  5. #5
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suckerpuncher View Post
    And did we also agree on changing the draft order for the next year? Like the champ drafting last and the 6th ranked team after the plyoffs drafting 7th?
    If not I propose it right now.
    Here's my reasoning behind it.

    It gives every team something to play for even if you are fighting for 9th instead of 10th in the final week. If we do it the usual way then what is to prevent me from tanking on purpose just to get the first pick in the draft? This way the consolation side of the playoffs actually means something.

    If you can show me why a different way would be better I am more than willing to listen.

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  6. #6
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    I can agree with you on how to determine the draft order for the #1 to #6 spot to some degree. Although it's harder for the bottom teams to rebuild via draft.

    Right now the worst team of the regular season is also likely to finish 12th in the playoffs and would draft 6th overal while a championship playoff contender who missed the playoffs by maybe a point will likely end up winning the consolation bracket and end up with the #1 overall draft pick.
    That would make an already good team better and a bad team would not improve as much.

    Maybe it's a also a good idea to take the regular season finish into account for the #1 to #6 draft spot and just take the reverse order of the regular season like it's done normally in sports (more or less).
    But that would render the consolation bracket pretty much useless since teams have nothing to gain (or lose).
    And you could argue that teams would lose on purpose over the last weeks of the regular season. But I think everybody in the league has enough integrity and spirit to not do that.


    But the spots from #7 to #12 should defintefively be determined differently.
    All the teams in the championship bracket fight for something at least in the beginning of the playoffs. And I think the champ should draft #12.

    I suggest the following order for the spots #7 to #12:
    #7 loser of the 5th place matchup (6th placed team)
    #8 winner of the 5th place matchup (5th placed team)
    #9 loser of the 3th place matchup (4th placed team)
    #10 winner of the 3th place matchup (3rd placed team)
    #11 loser of the championship matchup (runner-up)
    #12 winner of the championship matchup (Champion)

    Maybe change #7 and #8 to avoid somebody losing on purpose.
    Since the other 2 matchup have a trophy on the line everybody will gives his best to win.


  7. #7
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suckerpuncher View Post
    I can agree with you on how to determine the draft order for the #1 to #6 spot to some degree. Although it's harder for the bottom teams to rebuild via draft.
    With 96 people kept, I don't think the 97th best player will be that much better than the 102nd best player.

    Right now the worst team of the regular season is also likely to finish 12th in the playoffs and would draft 6th overal while a championship playoff contender who missed the playoffs by maybe a point will likely end up winning the consolation bracket and end up with the #1 overall draft pick.
    That would make an already good team better and a bad team would not improve as much.

    Maybe it's a also a good idea to take the regular season finish into account for the #1 to #6 draft spot and just take the reverse order of the regular season like it's done normally in sports (more or less).
    But that would render the consolation bracket pretty much useless since teams have nothing to gain (or lose).
    What would be my reason for playing once I know my team is out of the playoff spot.
    And you could argue that teams would lose on purpose over the last weeks of the regular season. But I think everybody in the league has enough integrity and spirit to not do that.
    Maybe enough integrity to not bench your team, but can you honestly say would search the Waiver wire as hard or take as long to figure out which SP you would start on a given day? I would hate to be in 6th place in the last week and see that the 7th place team is playing a team who doesn't want to win.


    But the spots from #7 to #12 should defintefively be determined differently.
    All the teams in the championship bracket fight for something at least in the beginning of the playoffs. And I think the champ should draft #12.

    I suggest the following order for the spots #7 to #12:
    #7 loser of the 5th place matchup (6th placed team)
    #8 winner of the 5th place matchup (5th placed team)
    #9 loser of the 3th place matchup (4th placed team)
    #10 winner of the 3th place matchup (3rd placed team)
    #11 loser of the championship matchup (runner-up)
    #12 winner of the championship matchup (Champion)

    Maybe change #7 and #8 to avoid somebody losing on purpose.
    Since the other 2 matchup have a trophy on the line everybody will gives his best to win.
    I think the regular season champ is a lot more indicative of the strongest team, the playoffs can be a crapshoot. In your proposed order above, the regular season champ could finish in 6th place and get 7th in the draft order.

    In my mind having the top 6 picks determined by the consolation finals and the bottom 6 determined by the regular season will always be the fairest way to do things. The top 6 teams could tank to improve their draft position (if they knew they could still make the playoffs), but that would mean they play a better/tougher team on the way to the championship. The bottom 6 teams could tank, but that would mean they have to play a harder team on the way to the consolation chamionship and the #1 overall draft pick.
    I may be playing devil's advocate with some of this, and of course I would never tank - but you haven't shown how your way of deciding the draft order improves the league.

  8. #8
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    I know it's hard to come up with a real good solution that takes everything into account.

    Right now the bottom half is not determined by the the regular season standings. If the list of teams you posted above is the draft order then the bottom half is still determined by the championship playoffs.
    The winner got pick #7 and the 6th place team got pick #12.

    After the playoff is over Yahoo alters the final standings. All spots will be order by the playoff result. The #1 spot always goes to the champ even if was #6 after the regular season.

    If you want to determine the order by ther regular season standings then you have to take the order right when the playoffs begin.
    And even then the order should be reversed. The regular season winner should draft last.


    And yes there might be some difference between the 97th player and 102nd player in a keeper league draft. If 1 or 2 teams have more great players than they can keep those players are more valueable in the draft and can make a difference.


    Maybe the rest of the league can also give their opinion on the draft order.



    This now has nothing to do with the draft order.
    I wanted to complete my keeper list soon and I'm still not sure how a "rookie" was determined. Unfortunately I can't find that information on the group page that's way I have to ask here.


  9. #9
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suckerpuncher View Post

    After the playoff is over Yahoo alters the final standings. All spots will be order by the playoff result. The #1 spot always goes to the champ even if was #6 after the regular season.

    If you want to determine the order by ther regular season standings then you have to take the order right when the playoffs begin.
    And even then the order should be reversed. The regular season winner should draft last.
    Good catch, I just grabbed the list from the Group page. The draft order is:
    1. Pockets
    2. Diamond Dogs
    3. Cooperstown Legends
    4. Schomi Skydogs
    5. PhilaFury (who we need a replacement for)
    6. Rico
    7. Suckerpuncher
    8. Hiro Mets
    9. GreenMonster
    10. Cashew Losers
    11. Hawkeyes
    12. Base Bandits



    As for the keeper rule: any guy who hasn't appeared in 30 or more games in 3 years can be kept as one of the bonus guys.
    Also, I want to bring the Max moves from 55 to 50. I think 50 is still high and no one came close to that number last year.

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  10. #10
    Senior Member Third Liner Winger72's Avatar
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    I'm back in, Base Bandits.

    As for the draft order, I think Picks 1-6 should be determined by the consolation round of the playoffs. It gives the teams in the lower half a reason to keep playing. As for Picks 7-10, if you guys want to use regular season finish, that's fine with me.

  11. #11
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winger72 View Post
    I'm back in, Base Bandits.

    As for the draft order, I think Picks 1-6 should be determined by the consolation round of the playoffs. It gives the teams in the lower half a reason to keep playing. As for Picks 7-10, if you guys want to use regular season finish, that's fine with me.
    Nice to see you back. And the draft order you mentioned is the one used a couple posts above

  12. #12
    Go Bolts Hall of Famer dw13's Avatar
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    I'll take the open spot? If he doesn't come back?



  13. #13
    Sig Maker All-Star looch17's Avatar
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    Im back rico. GreenMonster.










  14. #14
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    Hi

    The Skydogs are back.

    But there is a problem. My computer broke down last month, so i only can use the internet at work. That will be a problem at weekend. I hope, i didn't hold up the draft to much.

    Schomi

  15. #15
    Sig Maker All-Star looch17's Avatar
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    Nice I just noticed we have a replacement for PhilaFury. Welcome to the league dawinna13.










  16. #16
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schomi View Post
    Hi

    The Skydogs are back.

    But there is a problem. My computer broke down last month, so i only can use the internet at work. That will be a problem at weekend. I hope, i didn't hold up the draft to much.

    Schomi
    Good to see you back, I think we can work out the issues.


    Roy, which team are you??

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  17. #17
    Junior Member Fourth Liner
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    The Cashew Losers are in!

  18. #18
    Full-Time hockey maniac All-Star Hawkeye's Avatar
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    Whoa I'm drafting 11th??? Did I lose in finals or something???

    I'm in BTW. And Rico, is the rookie rule apply to whatever player who hasn't been in the league for 3 years?? I don't quite understand the 30 games in 3 years... Is it 30 games every year for 3 years or is it combines.

    I'm just trying to get specifications...




  19. #19
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    Whoa I'm drafting 11th??? Did I lose in finals or something??? You are drafting 11th b/c you finished 5th in the league.

    I'm in BTW. And Rico, is the rookie rule apply to whatever player who hasn't been in the league for 3 years?? I don't quite understand the 30 games in 3 years... Is it 30 games every year for 3 years or is it combines.
    As long as your players hasn't played in 3x30 you are fine, if he has only been in the league 1 or 2 years you don't need to worry about it.
    I'm just trying to get specifications...
    I also added a text file with all of the rules on the group page.

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  20. #20
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    Snipes16 is going to be filling in for us if we cant get a response from either of the two remaining teams. If neither team responds, Snipes has asked for Cooperstown Legends and we will find another replacement.

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  21. #21
    Junior Member Fourth Liner
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    Hi all

    I just talked to HIRO. He will be in this season.

    Schomi

  22. #22
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schomi View Post
    Hi all

    I just talked to HIRO. He will be in this season.

    Schomi
    Why hasn't he replied to the numerous emails? Is he going to have any trouble with the deadline or posting for his keepers?

    That just leaves Cooperstown Legends missing - Snipes, keep your fingers crossed...

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  23. #23
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    I think Cooperstown is Oopah's team. He hasn't been here for quite some time but he's active in our hockey keeper.
    I'll sent him a mail via the hockey league interface and ask him if we need a replacement or not.


  24. #24
    Hockey is Back, baby! All-Star Amazing Oopah's Avatar
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    yeah, guys don't kick me out!

    sorry, haven't visited the forums in a while but I'm still active games wise. Count me in for next season.

    and since I'm late checking in, I'll send you my keepers today to make up.
    Last edited by Amazing Oopah; 01-16-2008 at 12:45 PM.

  25. #25
    Sig Maker All-Star looch17's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amazing Oopah View Post
    yeah, guys don't kick me out!

    sorry, haven't visited the forums in a while but I'm still active games wise. Count me in for next season.

    and since I'm late checking in, I'll send you my keepers today to make up.
    Welcome back. I didnt think you were going to make it in time.










  26. #26
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    Glad to see you are back Oopah!
    Thanks for figuring it out sucker

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  27. #27
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    OK everyone has confirmed they are in.

    Thats a good start but someone still hasn't joined the Yahoo group page. http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group...ll_Keeper/join

  28. #28
    Sig Maker All-Star looch17's Avatar
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    Team Name - HI Name

    Pockets - ???
    Diamond Dogs - ???
    Cooperstown Legends - Amazing Oopah
    Schomi Skydogs - Schomi
    PhilaFury - dawinna13
    Rico - rico3994
    Suckerpuncher - suckerpuncher
    Hiro Mets - ???
    GreenMonster - soty
    Cashwer Losers - cashewryan
    Hawkeyes - Hawkeye
    Base Bandits - Winger72

    Hey Rico, I put this together so it would be easier for you/ us to get a hold of each other. It may even be a good idea to post this on the group page incase this thread disappears. Your call just my 2 cents.










  29. #29
    Senior Member First Liner rico3994's Avatar
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    ^ Thanks. Hiro and Pockets aren't on HI. I think Hiro is a friend of suckerpunchers, and Pockets is a buddy of mine.

    Diamond Dawgs is royhinske and this list will be in the excel file we use to keep track of who has and has not been taken.

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  30. #30
    Hockey is Back, baby! All-Star Amazing Oopah's Avatar
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    can we expect the list of all available players by tomorrow? I may be away from the computer all day on Monday so I would like to send you a list of players by sunday at the latest so I don't slow you guys down.

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